Home > Current Affairs, Dystopia, Economy > This Is What A Dysfunctional Society Looks Like: Jun 21, 2011

This Is What A Dysfunctional Society Looks Like: Jun 21, 2011

Ever wonder how dysfunctional the USA has become? Here is an example-

US man stages $1 bank robbery to get state healthcare

He told the paper he had lost his job after 17 years as a Coca-Cola delivery man, and with it his health insurance. He was in increasing pain from slipped discs, arthritic joints, a gammy foot and a growth on his chest. Since being in the jail he has attained his goal: he has been seen by nurses and an appointment with a doctor is booked.

A video clip of his interview-

Comments?

  1. June 21, 2011 at 12:18 pm

    see, Mr. Crapacoli–American’s are an innovative bunch….

    manipulate the system!!!!

  2. pud
    June 21, 2011 at 3:31 pm

    This is why we need to deregulate our healthcare system.

    The current government-corporate partnership isn’t working, and the answer is NOT more government.

    So why does this never occur in any other developed country? All of them have far more socialized healthcare systems than the USA, but paradoxically they have better outcomes (life expectancy etc) and lower costs.

    • DoesNotMatter
      June 22, 2011 at 3:45 pm

      it does occur in other developed countries. You are just choosing not to look. you look, you find.

      Are you seriously implying that being poor in, say ,Germany or France is as bad being poor in the USA? Then again, a high degree of self-delusion is a very N.American trait.

      BTW, the guy who held up the bank….NICE!
      you……..not so much

  3. anonymous
    June 21, 2011 at 6:27 pm

    Don’t know about better health care overseas, especially Europe. The system is set up for bribery and those that have money get better treatment. My aunt died from an aneurism in a Greek hospital after simple knee surgery. Yeah those things happen.

    and these things never happen in the USA? are you seriously implying that outcomes for generic treatments are that different in developed countries?

    sorry to burst your bubble, but unless you are at somewhere like john hopkins or mayo- the average and median quality of medical treatment in the USA (outcome based) is inferior to other developed countries.

    And as far as better outcomes, you must also remember that the laid back lifestyle, 8 weeks of vacation, their diets and overall quality of life should all be taken into account.

    • June 21, 2011 at 7:45 pm

      I agree. Americans should also get 8 weeks of vacation, better diets and better overall quality of life.
      —-

      Xamuel,

      What is behind this american obsession with living a shitty life in the hope of winning the lottery? Are most people that dense?

  4. demirogue
    June 21, 2011 at 9:37 pm

    Just so you know, my mother is dying of pancreatic cancer even though for years she was treated for IBS and colitis. We assume it started out at colon cancer many years ago and went undiagnosed. And even though she made regular visits when it was finally “discovered”, it was spread into her abdomen and throughout most of her mid section.

    Don’t for a second think the medical system is better here because doctors have to follow certain protocols and have their hands tied for the most part. Veering off can be grounds for not only dismissal, but lawsuits as well.

    Sorry to hear about your mother, but you should know that most people do not enter med school because they want to help the world. They do it for the money.. patients are rather low on their list of priorities.

  5. demirogue
    June 21, 2011 at 9:40 pm

    Xamuel :
    I agree. Americans should also get 8 weeks of vacation, better diets and better overall quality of life.
    —-
    Xamuel,
    What is behind this american obsession with living a shitty life in the hope of winning the lottery? Are most people that dense?

    The lottery most should hope for is a quick death, Watching my mother literally starve to death is not something akin to winning the lottery.

    Tort reform and also allowing doctors the freedom to make decisions not based on following standard procedures but using the brains should be a top priority.

  6. Rollo Tomassi
    June 22, 2011 at 5:17 am

    What’s ironic will be the Randian “bootstrappers” who’ll take offense to this guy ‘manipulating’ the system, but the banksters and hucksters who manipulate the same system for their own profit are their role models.

  7. A Equals A
    June 22, 2011 at 8:32 am

    Rollo Tomassi :
    What’s ironic will be the Randian “bootstrappers” who’ll take offense to this guy ‘manipulating’ the system, but the banksters and hucksters who manipulate the same system for their own profit are their role models.

    Wrong. “Randians” oppose any system where someone can receive undue benefits through “manipulation”. That’s not capitalism. That’s fraud and dishonesty.

    Manipulation is only possible in a society where the cards are stacked in some interest groups favor via government intervention into the markets. Getting away with “manipulation” in a laissez faire economy is impossible without due consequences.

  8. pud
    June 22, 2011 at 9:00 am

    pud :
    This is why we need to deregulate our healthcare system.
    The current government-corporate partnership isn’t working, and the answer is NOT more government.

    So why does this never occur in any other developed country? All of them have far more socialized healthcare systems than the USA, but paradoxically they have better outcomes (life expectancy etc) and lower costs.

    FYI: Most European nations are implementing “austerity measures” (aka budget cuts) because they can no longer afford their silly socialist welfare schemes.

    Have you EVER seen anything approaching the dysfunction in the US healthcare system in any developed country? Why not?

    PS: The US healthcare system will collapse long before any other socialist system comes near that point.

    Also, never underestimate the value of culture. A nation of Germans or Swedes is far different from a nation that is burdened by a massive black underclass like we have in America.

    I see a lot of fat, racist and sub-human whites in motorized scooters sucking air from tanks.

  9. The Real Vince
    June 22, 2011 at 11:35 pm

    Guess who else is instituting austerity measures? The United States. We spend shitloads on health-care and get shitty outcomes.

    Health care is a case of market failure (requires specialized knowledge, decisions are not easily reversible, pressing circumstances make it difficult to shop around, and so on).

    Not to sound redundant but Randroids are full of shit. Their anti-empirical, moralized ideology insists that anything good is the result of the market and anything bad the result of government. There’s no sense arguing with them because they’re emotionally interested in the virtue of selfishness. Even if one could demonstrate that a universal system generates better overall outcomes they should still think such a system is immoral and utilitarian because it uses compulsory taxes to pay for others. If they would only shed the pretense and admit they’re not interested in facts then these discussions can move along much faster.

    • June 25, 2011 at 5:18 am

      Democracy is a case of government failure. Choosing a good politician requires specialized knowledge, decisions are not easily reversible, social pressures make it difficult to change policies.

      Well, so how well do systems based on other ideas work?

      • The Real Vince
        June 25, 2011 at 11:22 am

        You’re going to have government failure regardless of whether or not you have a democracy. Democracy is the least-worst system precisely because it critically depends on the consent of the governed, which allows for a measure of reversibility, accountability. But that’s neither here nor there.

        When it comes to health care administration we’re talking about bureaucrats, and you’re going to have bureaucrats in for-profit medicine as well as public. Compare the universal models around the world to the for-profit sector in the United States and the former emerge as models of efficiency.

        As for an earlier poster’s laughable contention that wherever we’ve had deregulation things have gotten better… that’s an article of free-market fundamentalism. In cases of deregulation gone bad, the libertarian crowd invariably screams that the government bungled it (see for instance California’s energy policy in the earlier part of the previous decade). It’s an unfalisifable faith.

        As noted earlier, it a simple matter when dealing with Randian types: if one could demonstrate that a universal health insurance scheme promoted the greatest good for the greatest number, then does it justify taxing YOU to help pay for little Billy’s heart operation?

  10. June 23, 2011 at 9:04 am

    Healthcare in the USA is already run by the government. That’s why it’s such a mess.

    Every single old person is on Medicare, which is a government program. Every single poor person is on Medicaid, which is a government program.

    We have a MASSIVE federal bureaucracy called HHS, which has a budget of $800 billion and controls every single aspect of the healthcare industry. Not just safety regulations, but actually manipulating the market and engaging in a de facto command and control economy.

    Haven’t you ever wondered why health insurance is tied to your job? Haven’t you ever wondered why you need health insurance in the first place? (Instead of just buying healthcare like any other product.) It’s because the government has fucked everything up.

    Then idiots on the left want to give even more power to the government. It makes no sense.

    Deregulation worked great for the airline industry, the telecommunications industry, the beer industry, and every other place it’s been done. So let’s do it for healthcare too.

    • Ted
      June 23, 2011 at 10:50 am

      “Haven’t you ever wondered why health insurance is tied to your job? Haven’t you ever wondered why you need health insurance in the first place? (Instead of just buying healthcare like any other product.) It’s because the government has fucked everything up.”

      During the Great Depression, government stepped in and set most wages. In order to attract and keep talent, companies could not offer more money as an option. To satisfy the private sector, the feds allowed companies to offer health benefits to their employees, tax-free. This perk continued after the Depression ended. Companies and employees like it, because when offered, say, $300 in income to be taxed, or $300 in health benefits tax-free, most took the later.

      Secondly, healthcare is not just like any other product. You consume healthcare before you are even born. Even Hayek argued that health care is probably the one sector of the economy that should not be left entirely at the whims of the market. BTW – having bought those individual plans – I can tell you most are crap. Even if you are healthy, don’t smoke, and are at the right weight, the best you can hope for is a plan that covers 80% of health care costs, which only kick in after you pay an additional 4 figures in deductibles. Besides insurance, how many other products ask you to first buy something, and then pay more before you get the benefits. When I buy a car, I can drive it off after I buy it – I don’t have to pay more money first. When I got my Kindle, I did not have to pay an additional $100 before I could get a book.

      Even if you as a consumer shop around for the best health plan, if you go for surgery, you doctor decides which labs test your samples, what kind of painkillers you get, etc. He will not pay any attention to your cost preferences. I would get bills from labs I never heard of, and my insurance company refused to pay, because the labs my blood or urine were sent to were not “in-network”. It’s a bloody shell game.

      • June 25, 2011 at 5:32 am

        “Even if you as a consumer shop around for the best health plan, if you go for surgery, you doctor decides which labs test your samples, what kind of painkillers you get, etc. He will not pay any attention to your cost preferences. I would get bills from labs I never heard of, and my insurance company refused to pay, because the labs my blood or urine were sent to were not “in-network”. It’s a bloody shell game.”

        So how is this any different when the government is involved? When health care is completely government-regulated, if you go for surgery, the government decides which labs can test your samples, what kind of painkillers you get, etc., and the government will not pay any attention to your cost preferences.

        In a market system at least there is a feedback mechanism (the price mechanism, i.e. profit and loss) which determines what kind of health care is produced and in what quantities, and you always have the escape hatch of paying more to get more — whereas in a goverment-controlled system rationing of health care occurs. And the health care is rationed based on no rational or objective criterion whatsoever, and you are stuck with whatever the government has decided to give you.

        How does that work in practice?

        Where is medical care rationed more? In private “free market” systems or in socialist “rationed” systems? What about outcomes? What about cost? What about private bankruptcy? Would you rather prefer a sociopathic CEO or lawyer make the decision for you?

        To reiterate my point- How do things work in real life?

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